H.B. 380 Hospital Workplace Violence Reporting Requirements: transcript

Thank you Mr. Chair. Thank you for having me. Um, so this bill was brought to me by some nurses, um, who are worried about the hospital workplace violence, um, that we see that we've seen kind of, um, ramp up over the last few years. Um, there has been some enhancements made, um, for workplace violence. Um, if you, if you have, uh, you know, a threat, um, against employee or healthcare facility. And those enhancements, uh, are repealed in 2027 January. So one thing this does is set that repeal date, extend the Sunset to 2032. Um, but, but more importantly, what the bill does is asks for, um, reporting in, um, the reporting of workplace violence to be centralized, not centralized, but reported to DHHS so that we can, um, kind of try to get a handle on, is it, is it rising? Is it ebbing? Is it what's going on with it? Um, all. So it calls for a hospitals to, um, to establish a reporting system, which most, if not all hospitals already have their own reporting system. This is just asking, uh, to gather all the information in one spot so we can see if there's a trend. Um, all the hospital, the hospital association spoke to it, um, in, in previous committee. And, um, all the stakeholders have been even either neutral or, or, um, supportive. And that's my presentation. Thank

Yep. Just extending that enhancement. And, and so we can look at, um, hopefully we'll get some of this data and see, you know, in, in the next few years. Do we need to have that enhancement? Do we need to do something with that as well?

Yeah. What was, so it goes to 2032, that's the extension? Yes. Yeah. And, uh, what's the enhancement from what to what?

Oh, goodness. Now you're, I'm trying to find it. Yeah, there's too much. I'm looking at the bill. Just on the bottom is talking about subsection and it doesn't gimme an opportunity to link that. Well, maybe, let's see. Um, yeah, so this was put in place in 24 And it, it Uintah 2027. Now we're extended to 2032. And I just can't find the, the handsome's not in the bill. Yeah, If, if you hit the link, I found the, if, if you hit the link right there on, in that section, it'll pull up the enhancement.

In One section it talks about assault or threat of violence against healthcare provider, emergency medical service worker or health facility, employee owner or contractor penalty. Well, mine won't link, but, Oh, sorry. It's, let's see, I'm looking for the exact enhancement. Okay, so let me read this. Sorry. I wish I had a, a violation of subsection two is a Class A misdemeanor. Now withstanding subsection three A, a violation of subsection two is a third degree felony if the actor cause a substantial bodily injury and acts intentionally or knowingly, that's the current enhancement that was put in place previous to this. So it goes from a a to a felony, or did I misunderstand that?

Um, well, if I'm reading this right, there's two, there's A and B. So maybe let me, let me give some, if it wouldn't, if it's okay, Ronan. Okay, hang on a second. We will. Sorry. Should have had that pulled up. No, it's a little confusing how, where to go to get it. Um, yeah, so the violation, if I'm looking here, subsection two. So, um, on subsection two, an actor commits assault or threat of violence against a healthcare provider. Emergency medical service worker. If the actor is not a prisoner, deny then goes through some criteria. An actor commits assault or threat of violence against a healthcare, a health facility employee. If then goes through some criteria, sort of stacks it, and then the violation, uh, it says violation of section two is a class A misdemeanor, and it is enhanced up to a third degree felony. If the actor caused substantial bodily harm or acts intentionally or knowingly.

I, Mr. Chair, I think I'm, I'm okay with it, but if I'll, I'll just talk with good spots. We'll just kinda look at the old section and make sure it was appropriate. It's a, it's, yeah, it looks like it stacks it a a bit, but yeah, we'll look at it.

Yeah. And just to clarify that her build does not increase that.

That was our, that was something that Was already there. Yeah. There, it's Juab. It's a little, it's a little hard to read as you just experienced. Yeah, it is actually. Because anytime you just references subsection, you gotta click the subsection and figure it out and then, then you gotta figure that one out.

Maryanne Martindale, Utah Academy Family Physicians, we strongly support this bill. We supported it back when it was first run in 2024. Um, during COVID, we saw a huge uptick in assaults and other aggressive behaviors towards healthcare personnel. We had hoped that as COVID sort of waned and we got kind of settled back into some sort of, some normalcy that would change. We have not seen that. And so we really appreciate the extension of this. Um, healthcare workers are there to provide care. They're not trained in self-defense. They're not armed, they're not prepared for any of this. And we see people punched, we see staplers thrown at them, clipboards, things like that. And it's just, it's really unfortunate, but we wanna protect our healthcare workers, so we really appreciate this. Thank you Mr. Chair.

I'm, I'm still gonna support it, but the whole idea of these is to deter. And if we're saying that it's not deterring it, then there may be a functional problem that goes beyond this. So, um, I'm just saying, I'm, I'm not, we, we don't need to, we don't need to go down a long road on it. But Juab I'm just saying if the facts are showing that it isn't deterring it, then there's another problem On enhancements is what you're talking About. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's the point of it, right? I mean, that's the entire point.

Yeah. And Could I make a quick response to that? I think one of the things that we like about this bill is it's got a data element. I hear things anecdotally. I don't, I don't know the volume of it. I mean, they call me when these things happen, but it might be three people, it might be 33 people. We just don't know. So I think the data part is really important to find out if it really is as big of an issue as we are have been hearing. Can you do an A Thank you.

Thank you. I'm an A to a felony. Felony, yeah. Okay.

So it does stacking it actually, it it does, it's a pure enhancement.

Okay.

And, and like she said, that is the, the main port part of the bill is that data collection. So we can see, do we, do we even need to have the enhancements anymore? And if, if making a different, um, date on that enhan, uh, on the Sunset makes sense.

I'm all, I'm absolutely all for that until we get some of the data to see. Do we need to extend it? Maybe we don't.

This is Diane Forster Burkin. I'm with the Utah Nurses Association and we worked with Representative Hall on this bill. We also worked with representative spend love on the, um, initial penalties and enhancements, um, that he set in place in his bill in 24. And historically, hospitals have kept data, but they've kept it within their own walls and not shared it. And so this bill would be really good that it goes through the Department of Health and Human Services. And only when you understand the real issue and how many often is occurring, can you create good policies to prevent and develop strategies to prevent these situations from occurring. When Dave Gsel from the Hospital Association testified in the house, um, business and Labor Committee, he said that there were estimated 21,000 incidents of violence between the dates of 2019 and 2023. Thank you very much for the sponsor for, to carrying this bill.

Can you guys hear me? Yes, go ahead. Okay. Rebecca Blair Stevenson, Utah Nurses Association. I am the nurse that brought this to Representative Hall and I'd like to thank her for, um, uh, putting this into play. Um, a couple things here, like Representative Hall said, hospitals are required to collect this data, but there is no regulatory agency that requires this data to be, um, externally reported. So to build upon the discussion about the enhanced, uh, penalties, having this data be public with the hospital, the patient and the accused de-identified this allows us to actually see what is happening, to determine if the enhanced penalty is still appropriate or if we need to, um, titrate up to a prevention bill. Um, because as, as a nurse and as a healthcare worker, um, enhanced penalties do nothing for us. Okay. They don't do anything to protect us. Um, so we would like to be able to see this data to determine if it's appropriate to in, uh, you know, um, uh, pro, you know, continue this enhanced penalty or if to see if we need to titrate to discuss the enhanced penalty a little bit. The enhanced penalty, uh, titrates, the, um, penalty up one step. So if the incident was a Class B dis, uh, misdemeanor to begin with, it upgrades it to a Class A. If it's a Class A, it upgrades it to a third degree felony. The classification and the enhancement depends on the severity of the incident and potential bodily harm. And that's all I have. Thank you very much.

Not to adjourn, but do motion to favorably recommend HB three 80? Motion to favorably recommend HB three 80.

One more. Motion to adjourn. Motion to adjourn. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. All right. This Bill Hospital Workplace Violence reporting requirements. This came to me from, um, a nurse who has noticed a lot more hospital violence against healthcare workers. And we, we know that hospitals track this, um, on their own. And this would be a bill that would kind of bring it all together and put it in one place. So we can see is this trend continuing upward? Is it flat lining? Is it, is it on the decline? Where are we at with it? Um, the other thing this bill would do is, um, extend the Sunset for, um, a few years ago they put in, um, an enhancement on workplace violence. And this would extend the Sunset for five years. And I think this will be good because it will help inform whether that Sunset we need to keep those enhancements or not, um, going forward. But I think this is a great bill, and I'm gonna turn over the time to, uh, the nurse that brought it to me. So I'll turn that time over to you.

Hello. Hello, my name's Rebecca Blair Stevenson. I am the Government Relations Committee chair for the Utah Nurses Association. And I don't talk on microphones very well. Thank you for having me here. Um, we know hospital workplace violence is happening. We just really don't know to what extent it is estimated that 80% of all nurses will experience workplace violence at some point in their careers. For me, personally, um, as a nurse, I have been hit bit, uh, spit on, had feces thrown at me. Um, I've been followed home and I have been stalked, um, via social media. We, fortunately, we do have some baseline data in Utah. In 2022, it was reported that there were, um, 21,813 reported events between 2019 and 2022. Obviously this was during COVID Pandemic and there were other contributing factors. But we also know that workplace violence is grossly under reported. Um, like Representative Hall said in 2022, HB 32 was passed, which included enhanced penalties for violence committed against hospital and healthcare workers. This made violence against a healthcare worker, either a class A misdemeanor or a third degree felony based on severity of the event. And again, it did have a Sunset date of January of 2027. So we rolled the extension of that Sunset date into this bill. So why do we need workplace violence data? Um, we really need this for tracking and training for future planning. Um, we have, we need to know if the enhanced penalties have mitigated workplace violence. We need to know if we need to continue the enhanced penalties, and we need to look at considerations for more preventative strategies. Prevention is the only way to help protect healthcare workers. Enhanced penalties do not help the victims. Uh, so what data will be collected? Uh, data will be collected, um, and reported to DHS. Um, we are requesting that the data be public with the hospital. The victim and the accused de-identified data will be used for comparison purposes only, uh, for tracking and trending year over year events. We would like to know if the events are physical or verbal assaults, uh, what unit the event occurred on, because we will take special consideration for events that occur on units with cognitively incapacitated patients, such as pacus and psychiatric units. And we would like to know if the event involved a weapon. Um, at the national level, there is a lack of data. OSHA has minimal data on healthcare related workplace violence. The only healthcare workplace violence data collected are injuries resulting in death or events resulting in three or more hospital days of hospitalization. Um, only injuries are reported to osha, and therefore, since we know that workplace violence events, many of them are, don't result in injuries, this data is pretty skewed. Uh, CMS provides regulations, um, excuse me, provides guidelines and expectations, but reporting is only advisory not mandated. There's no external reporting requirements. Language in the conditions of participation say, should not required. And finally, the Joint Commission does have a standard that requires internal monitoring and re and reporting. There's no language that requires external reporting to specific entities such as CMS or osha. Thank you. Thank you. And that concludes our presentation.

I, I personally am not aware of any. I don't know if you had seen any in other states. I think all facilities are starting a culture change to incorporate this into the overall functioning of the hospitals and their re personal reporting systems. Um, there are many states that have both reporting laws and um, um, prevention laws in place. This particular bill did come from Virginia, which, um, they've are being, they've been very successful in collecting the status thus far.

It was just, um, past, I believe in 2025. So it is still a work in progress, but their goal is to titrate up to a prevention bill based on the data that's collected.

who you are and who you represent. Uh, Dave Gessel. I represent the Utah Hospital Association, which represents all the Utah hospitals. We appreciate the sponsor working with us on this bill. Uh, our people that work at the hospital are our biggest asset. Uh, they know their nurses. Um, this is a tough issue 'cause it's a societal wide issue. In other words, uh, I I have no doubt, uh, that when we do this tracking, it'll show the trend still going up. Uh, this started about 10 years ago and it really, uh, went bad during COVID. A lot of people were, uh, attacking. And, and again, this isn't necessarily patients attacking, although that happens, this is often family members and others. And, uh, when I say it's a societal problem, uh, there's always been some of this, but it's almost become seemingly somewhat acceptable to do. And it isn't acceptable to do. And why I'm testifying is, is that I hope the legislature will think about, uh, that this isn't just a hospital problem or a hospital employee problem. This is a broader problem that we need to get a better handle on. And part of it is public education that, uh, you know, I volunteer every week at a, at one of our hospitals for about four hours. And I see the dedicated service Given by nurses and many other people, and they're just trying to do their best. They, they're compassionate. It takes a unique person to wanna serve people like they serve. And, uh, and then when these things happen, it's, it's just traumatic. And, and, uh, there the hospitals, when you ask us, uh, are we doing things absolutely, uh, are we doing enough? Uh, you know, I don't know. And I think this data will help us, but, but this again, is, I don't know if we can solve it alone. And what I'm trying to say is that we need to think about this broader in ways that we can educate the public. One of the reasons we're we authorizing and we, we like the enhanced penalty. 'cause I think that has some deterrent effect, but I don't know if it's enough. I mean, I, I, when did it become acceptable to, uh, do what happened to this nurse? As I testified, it's not acceptable behavior and we're seeing it more in other parts of society. So again, I'm not trying to, uh, load it off on you or others. Uh, the hospitalists are trying, they can likely do better jobs and, and are trying to do a better job, but it's, uh, it's, it's a sticky, uh, challenge. And it's, frankly, sometimes, probably most times it's not foreseeable in the sense of what happens in that particular moment. And, uh, the families, I, I understand that. I see that when I volunteer that they're very stressed. It's one of the most stressful time in their lives, but it's never acceptable to, to hurt another person that's trying to help you. So thank you.

Hi. Afternoon again. Uh, Maryanne Martin Deac. Okay, perfect. Physicians, I'm sorry I didn't, uh, say my name the last time. I, I know you all. So I just sort of assume, um, we're strongly supportive of this. Um, I can't tell you the stories that I've heard from physicians. So we heard from nurses, but I mean, this is across the gamut of healthcare providers. Um, we really had hoped, we saw a huge acceleration during COVID. We really hope that after COVID sort of calms down that maybe we'd would see things temper a bit. And we have not. And it's concerning because people are getting attacked, um, on a fairly regularly basis. All, all sorts punched, kicked, uh, bodily fluids thrown at them. Um, you know, and, and to Dave's point, it's not just healthcare workers that are having this, but obviously this is what this bill is focused on. So, um, data is gonna be really critical because right now we have a lot of anecdotal stories we hear from the people, but we don't actually know just how widespread it is. So I think this will help us to see if there are other potential policy things that we can do. So I, we strongly support this bill and encourage you to pass it. Thank you.

Okay. Um, do we have a substitute? I'm just looking to see, no,

Okay. I move that we pass out with a favorable recommendation, HB three 80 hospital workplace violence reporting requirements.

Thank you. That would be great. I'll just make a quick comment. Um, I, this in no way is saying that this is the fault of hospitals or clinics or any, anything. And, and Mr. Geel is right there is, we do have a societal issue with this right now. As nurses, we do get training on all of this. We do get training, we get training on how to diffuse situations and how, how to do our best. But sometimes those things still happen. And so I think this data collection all in one place is gonna really be able to help us inform what's going on and are there more things that we can do. So I'd appreciate your vote on this. Thank you.

for its consideration. Madam Marine Clerk House Bill three 80 Hospital Workplace Violence reporting requirements by Representative Hall. This bill was heard in Health and Human Services with the vote of 8 0 6

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Um, HB three 80. All this does is says that hospitals need to develop a, a workplace violence reporting system. Most of our hospitals do already have these, um, things where they collect it. We're just saying they need to develop a, um, incident reporting, uh, system, and that they also need to, to, uh, report the, the numbers to the department annually. Um, we are seeing a rise in workplace violence, and so we feel like if we can consolidate those numbers and see is it really on the rise? Is it decreasing? Is there things that we need to do to help decrease workplace violence in the healthcare space? Um, this, this bill will help to do that. We also, um, this bill also extends the Sunset on some enhancements that were done in a bill about five years ago as well. And that's the bill. I'm happy to take any questions?

Let me look. Yes. Did we not adopt that in committee

Representative Tom Peterson. Thank You, Mr. Speaker. Make a motion to adopt the first amendment to HB 360.

Sorry. Um, that's a friendly amendment. Just trying to remember. Yes, that's the friendly amendment.

for some previous criminal enhancements for certain crimes against, uh, an employee of a healthcare facility. And I think it makes some smart moves about protecting people against potential retaliation when reports are made. Um, this bill is good for our healthcare workforces, which are facing increased stressors, and I'm certainly open to any questions. Thank you. Senator Plumb.

Yeah. Can you, can you tell me the difference in, uh, does this differentiate in the penalty depending on who the victim is? Senator Plumb, will you yield?

Uh, absolutely. Go ahead, Senator Plumb.

You know, that's actually, I think, uh, an important question and I don't know that I can answer that with enough granularity. I can absolutely phone a friend and speak to LRGC. Do you, do you see one when you read it, Senator Brammer?

Well, that's why I'm asking the, the question. It's not, I'm not trying to cross examine with, with the answer in place. What, but what I am worried about, and I've seen this, uh, quite a bit, it happened quite a bit during COVID, was the idea that depending on who the victim is, we need to extra protect these victims versus other victims for violence. And, you know, so then it kind of gets to the point, well, when people are assaulted, if there's violence, is one worth less than the other or is one more punishable than the other? And are all people equal before the law or are they not? And does your profession mean that you're more valuable or less likely to be, you know, that we want to disincentivize people from assaulting certain people more than others. And, and so I do have reservations on kind of the, the hospital workplace violence stuff. If this is merely reporting, that's one thing. But if it's, uh, if it, if it continues the practice of enhancing penalties based on the victim, or if it does enhance the penalty based on the victim, then I will probably be a no on it. And so I'm trying to get to that question as to whether or not it does that. And I, I think, and Senator Plumb, I actually think that's an appropriate question to be asking.

The first portion of the bill down through section four is all about the reporting and a little bit of the protections against retaliation. The, the part, um, just after four where it talks about repealing the dates, um, from there was going to be a Sunset essentially in 2027 in subsection 76 dash five dash 1 0 2 0.7 sub two B. Can I almost be an attorney? Sorry. Um, that's the thing I think I need to dig in further to get the granularity on those questions answered for you. Um, I certainly, if we're willing to move forward on this bill, we'll get those answers and both get to them to you personally and on a third reading if it were so, so allowed.

Um, I do have a voice amendment, so I'm looking at line 59 and, uh, I'm, I'm there for all of the data collection and reporting. I think that will help keep health, you know, hospitals and healthcare workers safe. But I, I do prefer that the increased threat of violence, which is kind of a, that's a, uh, that came on the tail of COI, where there was a worry about, uh, violence within hospitals related to COVI and things like that. Uh, you know, I, I had some concerns then I still have those concerns. And so I would do a voice amendment to change on line 59, the year 2032, back to 2027, which is what the code currently reads. That would keep all of the reporting, but it would repeal the enhanced penalty based on who the victim is, which, in my opinion, violence is violence and a victim is a victim and they should all be protected equally under the law

I I have a thought that perhaps if we circled it now and I could get, uh, a little more information and perspective from the house, um, sponsor, I would have better information to offer if, if that would be an acceptable Step. Yeah. And I think that's more than fair. And with that I'll withdraw the motion And, and I'd actually take the motion to circle as a substitute motion. So I'll take that motion. That would be great.

You Mr. President ProAm, I have spoken with the house sponsor as has my colleague, Senator Brammer, and it sounds like we have, uh, an agreement to move forward. Um, Senator Brammer?

Yeah. Thank you. So we've been able to work through this, uh, we do have a voice amendment for it. And so when the circle's ready, I can give that, uh,

Uh, what it would be is on line 59, removing the year 2032 and replacing it with the year 2027, which is what the current code reads. And that is the only change. Yep. It's the same one made before, but we just have clarified that everyone seems to be okay with it.

Uh, thank you Mr. President Pro Tem. Uh, as I was mentioning, I, I do think that this is important work to be recording workplace violence that's happening in our healthcare settings, which, uh, was the original intent of the bill. And even with the date change, I believe this is a great bill and we should support it with that. I would call the question.

Ah, thank you. I'd love to call that question.

This bill requires hospitals to do some reporting and data collecting on violence and episodes that are happening within hospitals. As you recall, we made an amendment and adopted it yesterday, and I think it's in a good spot. I would encourage our vote.

for summation or motion. Thank You Mr. President ProAm. I would, with that I would call the question

Senator Vickers Baldy. Lewin b Brammer Bus Aye. Fillmore Es. Camilla Fillmore Aye. Grover Aye. Harper Aye. Hankins. Aye. Ipson Johnson Aye. Aye. Juab McKay. Aye. Mikel Aye. Milner Milner Aye. Musman Musman Owens pitcher Plum Rebi Sandal Stevenson Stratton Vickers Weiler Aye. Wilson Winterton, president Adams

Thank you Mr. Speaker. Motion to concur with the Senate amendments.

Yes. Um, all that happened was we took out this Sunset extension date on the enhancements.