H.B. 423 Hit and Run and DUI Offense Amendments: transcript

Uh, th Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um, I, I, I do have a sub that I'll be speaking to, and if it's, uh, permissible for the, uh, vice chair to pass out a flyer. Uh, absolutely. Yes. Okay. I'll have my intern do that. Thank you. Yes, thank you. Um, let me just give you a little background on this bill. It is, um, the, the substitute bill is actually the combination of, uh, HB 4 21 and 4 23. So, good news, I'll be abandoning HB 4 21 fewer bills, Representative Okerlund, this is for you. Um, and, um, there, there are some significant changes in both bills. So let me just give, uh, uh, uh, a ba a little bit of background. Um, what, what the, the substitute bill does. So currently, if an individual's involved in a hit and run, and if they leave the scene, there is a perverse incentive to leave the scene because you're gonna, the penalties for hit and run are, uh, less severe than they, they are for A DUI. And while I am not an attorney, and I'm not giving legal advice, there's a disclaimer. Um, I think that, uh, uh, uh, if a defense attorney was being honest with their client, if they were at the scene of the accident, they would say, you understand that if you leave, that you won't be able to be charged with a DUI. If you can leave for long enough to get your blood alcohol level down to a level that would not indicate impairment, that's not an incentive that we want. Um, the original bill was going to have, uh, such a situation when, uh, an individual leaves the scene for serious injury or death charged as a DUI. It was gonna have an affirmative defense. If they can prove through a chemical test that they weren't impaired, um, for a number of reasons, we've kind of scaled that back and it technically would not be charged as a DUI. However, we are aligning the penalties, uh, with the, the DUI code. So the penalties would be the same to remove that incentive to, to leave the scene. Um, currently, if somebody is involved in a hit and run that results in a fatality, it's a Class three misdemeanor that is not sufficient. If you kill somebody and then leave the scene, that is a, a, a very serious, um, penalty. This bill moves that up to a second degree felony. Also, if you, um, have had a previous DUI and, uh, leave the scene, then there's, uh, you have a previous DUI and then you're involved in a serious hit and run. This also, uh, increases the penalties. Um, I am joined, uh, by, uh, two, uh, uh, great witnesses here. Uh, uh, commissioner, uh, Anderson from, excuse me, commissioner Mason. Um, we've had too many changes lately. Uh, commissioner Mason, the, uh, uh, director of the Department of Public Safety. And, um, I'll let him describe the other changes related to the driver's license hearing. Go ahead.

Yeah, so one of the, oh, sorry. Bill Mason, commissioner for the Utah Department of Public Safety. One of the issues we run into with, with DUI, um, uh, hearings for the driver license portion, and that was what 4 23 was really aimed at, is fixing that problem. Um, the changes in here, really what they do is extend the timeframes. They change the timeframes. So the way it worked before is person arrested for DUI had 10 days to request a hearing, and then DLD had to hold that hearing within 30 days. What that, what hap ended up happening is a lot of these, these officers working DUI shifts, they're working weekend graveyard shifts. And so there, these hearings are held in the middle of the day. And so they would try to move them. Well, there was another clause in there where if an officer wanted to change it, they had to give 10 days notice to the, uh, the, the arrestee. And so it really became almost impossible for police officers to, to move these hearings to accommodate their schedules. So what this does, it changes the timeframes. Um, the person has to request the DLD hearing in five days, and then we've extended it out to a, a 45 day period in which that hearing can take place rather than 30. And then shorten that notice to five day at five day notice. It just allows for more flexibility. The hearing will still take place. Um, nothing changes with, with how the hearing happens. And it just moves the IM implementation date out to 60 days, um, rather than 45. So everything gets extended by 15, around 15 days. And, and really that is just an accommodation to try to get more officers present at these hearings. 'cause what often happens, if we can't have an officer there, action is not taken against the, the violator driver license and their license is not suspended or no action is taken. And so this is really just trying to clean things up to make it a more practical application of how we hold DLD hearings.

Uh, th Thank you Commissioner. Um, I'm gonna let, uh, Brett Robinson, who's the Chief Policy Advisor from the Salt Lake County District Attorney's Office, do a better job of explaining the hit and run components than I did. Alright,

Thank you. Um, Mr. Representative Elison and, and vice chair members of the committee, um, this is an incredibly Brett Robinson, chief Policy Advisor from Salt Lake County District Attorney's Office. Um, this is an incredibly important bill, um, in Utah alone, uh, since 2020, we had about 3,901 hit and run accidents per year. And after that, it's been over 5,000 per year through 2024. And a troubling trend, even nationally, is that the percentage of hit and run crashes that are fatal has risen from about 4.6 in 2008, nationally to 7.3 in 2022. In Salt Lake County alone, we've seen several heartbreaking cases of hit and run accidents that have resulted in death. And the problem with that right now is that for automobile homicide, if somebody is under the influence, if they stay and they're found to be under the influence and negligent in causing that accident, they're facing a second degree felony with a five-year mandatory minimum. If they flee, they have a chance of not ever getting caught for one. And even if they do, if it's been sufficiently long that they can't trace what they had in their system at the time, um, then the maximum they can face is a third degree felony. And that needs to change. And this bill does that. So now that if somebody does flee from an accident resulting in injury, if it's a death, it'll result in a second degree felony. If it's serious bodily injury, it'll be a third degree felony. If it's regular injury, it'll be a Class A misdemeanor. Um, there's another issue with HIT and runs, um, if for people who have prior DUI convictions, um, because we have mandatory enhancements and mandatory sentences for DUI convictions, and so even for a Class B misdemeanor, that's a hit and run. Um, if somebody gets in an accident, if they know they're under the influence, if they stay and they have priors, they run the risk of getting a much more severe penalty. Perhaps even a third degree felony, if they flee. The most that they can face, even if they get caught, is a, is a Class B misdemeanor. And this changes that. So if people do have prior enhanced prior convictions, either for A DUI or for a hit and run, or for things that count as prior, or DUIs like driving with measurable controlled substance, if they have those on their record and they get in a hit and run accident, then they will be held to a higher level of offense to decrease that motivation to flee. Um, There are many reasons that people can flee, and it's not always just because, um, that they're perhaps under the influence and they don't wanna face penalties. And that's why this mitigation is also applicable here. And it's important to know that if somebody does turn themselves in within six hours to a law enforcement agency that has jurisdiction over that area, and then they get mitigation. And what that would entail is that any enhancement that would've been based on prior convictions, um, wouldn't be enhanced. And they would get the same level of offense if they turned themselves in, if they would, um, had they had no priors, to make sure that they're encouraged to actually, um, turn themselves in even if they flee for other reasons. Importantly, though, that mitigation does not apply to injuries that result in serious bodily injury or death, those will remain at a third degree felony or a second degree felony, even if they later turn themselves in. However, still to encourage people to turn themselves in, if they turn themselves in, even at any time, even after that six hour window, that's still something that the courts must consider as a mitigating factor in their favor if they subsequently turn themselves in. Uh, and we thought that was probably a really good idea because closures always better in these cases, and it's important for them to get credit for that, um, at the time of sentencing. Um, but with that, there's a lot in this Bill. Happy to answer any questions that you may have, but we really want to thank Representative Lyon for bringing this forward. Uh, thank you. Um, as part of my presentation, I would next like to hear from, uh, Glennon Mitchell, um, before I left rep representative.

Yes, absolutely. Thank you for that question. Uh, Mr. Vice Chair and, um, representative, that's a great question. Right now, it's a Class B misdemeanor for property damage for the hit and run for the hit and run. Um, however, with this bill, it can be enhanced for prior convictions for DUI or prior convictions of, of hit and run. In which case, if they have one of those within 10 years, it would kick that up to a class A misdemeanor. Or if they had two within 10 years, we would kick it up to a third degree felony. But same penalties if it's a first time offense. But if it's a first time offense, um, it's only a Class B misdemeanor.

Th th thank you. So, um, uh, in terms of hearts and minds, we've been talking about the mines part of this bill. Now let's talk about the hearts part of this bill. Um, I'd like to introduce Glennon Mitchell and give him just a, a few, few minutes to talk. Before I left the room this morning, I saw somebody looking at me in my, uh, my next to my mirror. It's a picture that I've had up of Eli Mitchell. Eli is Glennon's, uh, grandson, who's no longer with us because of a hit and run driver. So I'd like Glennon to talk about this bill and briefly share his story. Glennon.

Hi, my name is Glennon Mitchell. I represent myself as you just heard. I'm a DUI victim. Thank you. Thank you for your time. Some of you know our situation, so I'll try to be brief. In April of 2022, my grandson, Eli, had gone to the grocery store to get some treats, was coming home on his bicycle, stopped to walk his bike across a crosswalk. He was ran over and killed, uh, by a driver who fled. Uh, the driver made a right turn, uh, a witness, I don't know if you know this, a witness jumped out into the street waving his arms, trying to stop the driver. The driver didn't stop, uh, did not render aid. The first, when he ran over, Eli didn't stop for that witness, waving his arms. Instead, he flipped a u-turn, drove right back to the accident scene. Uh, he did not stop to render aid. He made another right turn in the opposite direction, um, pulled into a shopping area and pulled Eli's bike out from, from under his truck. Um, he did not return to render aid. Um, he, uh, another witness chased him at high speeds and then stopped, uh, when the driver turned to go on Redwood Road, which is a high traffic street. If you're not familiar with Redwood Road. Uh, the driver disappeared for two hours later. Um, ended up parking his vehicle, um, in his neighborhood, uh, walked home where police were waiting enough witnesses had, had got pictures of the license plate that the police were there. Um, he, um, two hours later, um, at midnight. So it was six hours after the incident. His blood alcohol was tested and he was still impaired. So for our family situation, our driver was charged with a second degree felony. Uh, but the driver, apparently, he only, he knows his motives, did everything he could, including delaying the BAC test, um, to avoid the impairment piece. And he had, uh, five, multiple, or five prior DUIs. Uh, it, I, I can't describe to you the pain that you feel, uh, in your heart when you get word of a loss like that. There are no words. It's like someone stabs you in the heart. And then to find out that a careless, non-caring, inhumane driver fled the scene, just knocks whatever breath you have out of you. And I just encourage you, not out of emotion, but out of reason to support, uh, this bill and vote in favor for the bill. Thank you for your time.

Thank you. Uh, I'd like to now, uh, turn a few ti a few minutes over to Bradley Van Orman. Uh, he tragically recently lost his daughter, Lindsey, at the hands of a hit and run driver.

Yes. Um, Bradley Van Orman, um, like he stated, my daughter Lindsey Van Orman was killed in a hit and run accident. And, uh, I just wanted to share a couple of things very briefly. Uh, during this process, uh, they put out what I thought would be a A PB, you know, the, it was, uh, on social media. It was investigators with the Unified Police Department, and they were able to locate us through the help of the community. They found the suspect, fortunately. But during this process, uh, working with the investigator with UPD, Matt ak, if I'm pronouncing that right, uh, the investigator, I Uintah Matt with a question, you know, when the suspect was finally charged in this case. And I had asked him, you know, is that the extent of the charges is a hit and run when Lindsey was left on the side of the road dying and eventually died. And he said that, uh, his feeling is that a hit and run of this nature should be classified as a felony two, but it's only classified. It's a felony three. And, uh, further down the road at the sentencing hearing for this criminal and Lindsay's case, and that's a case ending in number 4 9 4 3 0, uh, judge Gardner presided over the case. And at the end of the sentencing, when he sentenced this criminal, uh, he said, and I'd just like to quote what he said at the end of this sentencing hearing, he said, I've sentenced you to the maximum, maximum that I can under the law. There's no more that I can do. And to me, that just says there needs to be a change. You know, and that's why I'm here to support the HB 4 2 1 and share Lindsey's story. So thank you for your time.

Thank you. Thank you, Brad. Um, the last part of my presentation, uh, I'd like to give, uh, art Brown, uh, a few, uh, moments to, to comment. Art has been a relentless champion of fighting against drunk driving, also a victim. Um, art, Thank you very much.

Um, I've served as a volunteer here for 25 years as mad, and the pain and grief cannot be spoken. I just want to share with you the cumulative effect, certainly on me and others of hearing this story over and over and over again. It's devastating. Um, there's one in Salt Lake City, which I live, he was hit close to 50 East, and they found the person parked in the Trader Joe's parking lot later. And when you hear these things, I just want to tell you, you've heard two stories. But they mount up in our community and they just keep coming, and they just keep coming because we let them. And so, I would encourage the passage of this bill, if it's injury or death, it should be an F two, and we mu just must stop this kind of behavior because the, a cumulative effect just multiply this many, many times. I just encourage the support of this bill 'cause there's no way to get rid of the extra grief no possible way for years. Thank you very much.

Uh, thank you Mr. Uh, vice chair. That concludes my presentation. Thank, thank you.

Hello, my name is, uh, Ryan Robinson. I'm the policy Director for the Statewide Association of Prosecutors, but I'm also the, uh, chief Prosecutor for West Valley City. And, uh, meaning that, uh, I represent mostly the misdemeanor segment of the prosecutor community in, uh, the state of Utah in West Valley. We file a go probably about a dozen, uh, hit and run misdemeanors, uh, a week. And, uh, to maybe the, the point or question of a Representative Dailey-Provost question, most of them are first offenders that, uh, got scared or made a dumb mistake. You know, often in the teenager variety, but even sometimes the dumb adults of, of all of us. But, uh, maybe about a third of my cases have a very different proto profile. We find alcohol or open cans of beer in the car. We find a suspect who's left his car disabled on the side of the road after they've plowed into somebody, and then took off on foot, not to be found, sometimes for hours or days or weeks to be identified by a detective before they screen the case with me. And then we look up the wrap sheet and they've got 1, 2, 3, 4, or more DUIs on the record. And you can connect the dots there, right? That is someone who is facing probably a felony DUI, and made a calculated decision to, uh, get the heck outta there. And it succeeds when that, uh, strategy is employed. Uh, they end up in a justice court or they have to pay a fine. Uh, and that's mostly it. Then they go on their way like they do for, you know, most minor traffic offenses. And, uh, it, the penalties doesn't fit the crime. And also we do, it doesn't give us the opportunity to get 'em a mandatory treatment su uh, probation officer. All the things that come with a DUI sentence really never apply to a, uh, hit and run. And occasionally we can make a strong argument and compel a judge to treat it a little more seriously. But often, really the, probably the default is they get, you know, the fine like you would for any other traffic violation. So we see this as a huge solution to a real problem in our community, uh, in West Valley, and I I'm sure statewide as well. So we appreciate, uh, the bill and we'd ask you to support it. Thank you,

Mr. Chair. I have a question for the witness.

Sure, please. I can do that. Yes, you can. I'm nervous.

Um, if an individual is involved in a serious, uh, hit and run leaves, the scene is then apprehended within a reasonably short window afterward. And a, a good defense attorney, like I'm joined by here on my right hand side, were to say, oh, my client had not been drinking or using drugs before the accident. They just got really stressed out after the accident. And then that's when they started drinking. From a pro prosecution perspective, how do you counter that

With great difficulty? Usually we file a hit and run class B misdemeanor instead of the, uh, like the more serious DUI we can't really disprove, right? They're innocent until proven guilty. And so, you know, common sense as they were drinking and driving. But the also reality is, if they had a one hour window, they could have put a whole bottle of vodka down their throat. And I can't really disprove that. And so ha treating the hit and run with the same seriousness as the DUI, only for those people with A DUI history and profile, uh, kind of mitigates that inherent problem in our, uh, situation that you've Described. Just what

Does Representative Eliason get to ask me questions as well? I could, I could do cross-examine, Um, hello committee, Steve Burton with the Utah Defense Attorney Association. And it, it's my job to provide the, um, contrasting perspective so that this committee has information from both sides. And, um, I want to express my sympathy to those who've, um, suffered because of these incidents. Um, I, I've represented both victims and, uh, defendants in these types of situations. So, uh, hopefully I have some understanding, uh, even though it's, it's very minor. Um, Uh, I, I think that the, the purpose of this bill is very noble. Um, there are some aspects of it that probably aren't quite hitting the mark. And, um, my hope is to be able to work with a sponsor to maybe, uh, amend some of those things or change a couple of things. Um, and so I'd just like to give this committee some examples. Um, as was mentioned by Mr. Robinson, most of the time when somebody flees the scene of an accident, it's because they're scared or they're dumb, or, um, maybe they forgot to put their driver's license in their pocket that morning or something like that, where they think, oh, shoot, what did I just do? I gotta get out here. It's a fight or flight type reaction. Um, and then there are those that subsection of people who are under the influencer or have taken some kind of substance, and they're doing it because they're like, oh, no, I really did something wrong. Um, but this, this treats those the same when they have a prior on their record. Um, what, so for example, one of my recommendations would be to change, uh, change the lines, which require that it's treated exactly the same as A DUI, when maybe there might not be indications that the person was DUI. So for example, if somebody had a DUI nine years ago, um, and then they got into a hit and run accident and they left, nobody's injured, nothing like that when they go to court, this requires, um, that the court treat them as if they were DUI. What we would suggest is that you give the judge discretion. So if somebody comes to court and the penalty is raised so that it's commensurate with A DUI saying, Hey, look, we have to presume that maybe you could have been DUII, I guess I would understand that. But then to have them do all of the things that a person who was actually DUI do as part of the sentencing, we're just saying, let the judge make that judgment call and say, yes, there are some indicators that you probably were DUI, therefore, I'm gonna make you do alcohol testing. I'm going to, um, make you have a, a, a license that's restricted. I'm going to require you to do a 24 7 alcohol program. I, I, if there's indications that the person was actually DUI we support that we don't want anymore. Um, but if it's the opposite, and it's like, well, that prior DUI was a really long time ago, and this really does look like something where the person was just worried, let's not force the court to impose sanctions that, that the court doesn't think even apply. Um, so that's, that's one way that, um, I think maybe we could tweak this, this bill, uh, that would still allow for the judge to make the right judgment call when it looks like the person was in fact, uh, intoxicated. Um, the second principle that I wanted to talk about, oh, and, and one last statistic on that, um, the, the DUI reports that come out every year from the state indicate that about 70% of people who get 1D UI never get a second. Um, and then another 20% will get a second, but never get a third. So the vast majority of people, um, when they, uh, get caught for this, they are, they, it's a wake up call and they never do it again. But it's those people who continue to get a DUI that we're most focused on. Um, that's why we want it targeted towards those people. Um, the second thing is, there's a, there's a change where the imposition of the driver's license suspension is extended to 60 days. And in the principles of deterring crime in the future, there's three main principles. The first one is, um, the, uh, swiftness of the consequence. The second one is the certainty of the consequence, and then the third one that has much less effect is the severity of the consequence. If a consequence is certain and swift, that's way, way, way more effective. If the consequence is more severe, that's much less effective at deterring behavior in the future. So what this does is it actually delays the consequence a little bit more upfront and increases the consequence on the backend. So if we're trying to reduce the number of DUIs in the future, that that might, that might miss the target a little bit. Um, it, it increases the ineffective deterrent method and it decreases the effective deterrent method. So, um, you know, our, our, our request would be trying to make it so that you focus more on that kind of certainty and, and swiftness and, and less on just increasing the penalty because it's just not quite as effective to deter future behavior. Thank you.

Jeremy, sorry I to get my video And camera on. Can you Hear me? Uh, Jeremy, can

Okay. Thank you. Sorry to, to impede your exodus there. Uh, I know it's tough being around Representative Eliason. He can, he can be grueling. We, we have a great, uh, relationship of mutual respect. Oh, good. Hey, my question is, uh, how about, uh, uh, prescription medication, uh, other, you know, over the counter products and so forth, how would this thing trigger that, uh, increased, uh, uh, penalty?

Yeah, I, um, and I've had, I've had, uh, cases personally where, um, I mean, you know, DUI is any kind of, uh, uh, substance like medication or alcohol or a combination of those. So I have had, uh, several DUI cases where somebody was prescribed Ambien, for example. And Ambien really messes you up. Sometimes, uh, you wake up and do things that you don't know you're doing. Um, you know, it tells you don't drive with this. But sometimes people are so affected by those types of medications, they don't know what they're doing. And so oftentimes we do have DUIs where somebody has taken medication, been groggy, not realizing what they're doing, goes out and drives and gets a DUI that would be a prior for, for this type of bill or other medications that say, you know, know, uh, may make you drowsy or something, and they think they're okay. And so they drive, but then they're, um, they get into an accident or something on, on a medication that many of us may take at some point. So, so that does apply and that's, that's, that's a perfect example of the type of person who probably isn't DUI the second time. Um, but this would require the same consequences as a DUI. So that's where we want the judge to have some discretion and say, wait a second, your prior DUI was a medication thing, it was seven years ago. Um, there's no other indication of drinking here. It looks like you were just scared and, and, and ran away.

So, okay. Thank you.

I'm sorry about that delay. Oh, you're totally fine. Um, thank you for allowing me to speak. My name is Jeremy Mitchell. Um, I'm, uh, Glennon Mitchell who just spoke to you. That is my dad. Eli Mitchell is my son who was hit and killed, um, by a drunk driver. And I just want to, to tell you real briefly, I have it every day wondering if that gentleman would've stopped and not proceeded, would that have F three 50 truck not have rolled over my son's body and killed him? Um, I feel like, and I, I understand what the defense attorney just said, this guy. It was it, I wanna say his, his last DUI, this was his sixth DUI when it happened. So he knew what he was doing. He had defense attorneys, he learned the law, and, uh, he knew, he knew that he had, was drunk and that if he could run and get out of it and get the alcohol out of his system, that there would be less consequences. And I, I wondered to this day, if he knew no matter what the consequences are, or they're gonna be the same consequence, whether I get the alcohol outta my system or not, if I stop and render aid, would that have changed things? Would that have, would my son be alive today if he would've done it? I keep, so, I, I, I, I hate to say it, but I think 10 years ago, 15 years ago when they've had multiple DUIs, it doesn't matter. They know they've been coached. So I would just ask you as a committee to please, maybe it'll make that person stop. We gotta do stuff to make it stop. I watch the news every time, and I al I feel like I, almost all the cases, it's always a hit and run. Why are we hitting and running? There needs to be consequences, and we need to make it public that guys stop. We did something wrong. I've texted, say I text somebody and hit somebody, okay, I'm in the wrong, I did it wrong. I'd probably like to flee from it, but let's stop and render aid and be accountable for my actions of what I did. So I would just ask today that you support the bill. This, it's not getting any better. I feel like we gotta continue to do things to put consequences in place to make people think, I know it's flight. I, I know the flight thing, but we got, we just gotta make people think. So I would just, again, ask the committee from a dad that's watched this from now talking to tons of victims, and there's a ton out there, and many of us think it's never gonna happen to us. I was one of those guys, this will never happen to me. That's a sad story I saw on the news. But when it happens to you, it destroys your life. You have to every day wake up in the morning and say, what am I gonna do different to make a good difference in this world? 'cause you kind of want to give up some time. So thank you for your time and allowing me to speak Representative Eliason, thank you for all that you've been doing to help, and hopefully we can stop these tragedies or really decrease them from happening to future people. And that's my agenda and goal. So thank you for your time.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I'd like to make a motion to move for substitute house bill 4 23.

It? I think the sponsor summed it up just fine.

Thank you. Thank you representative, and, um, to the families of Eli and Lindsay and everybody else who've been victims of this, um, my on behalf of myself, my family, my community, my condolences. Thank you for being here. I'm sorry that you hope that this is a story you have to share. Um, I'd like to make a motion to pass out House Bill 4 23 first substitute, um, with a favorable recommendation. And I'll speak briefly if I may. Yes, because I know we've got a bit, a heavy agenda. Um, my husband was actually in, in our neighborhood and was hit and the person drove away and incidentally lives right around the corner from me. Um, turns out he was driving erratically, was probably drunk and, but was also an attorney and knew that all he had to do was just drive away. And this was nothing compared to the stories we've heard. I mean, this was damage to a car, um, really irritating and really frustrating. But he called the police and the police said, you know, he said, I'm pretty sure he was drunk. And the police said, well, I mean, we could go to his door, but by the time we get there, he can just say, I drank a fifth of tequila in the last 20 minutes, so of course I'm drunk. And so, um, again, I'm not trying to draw any parallels, but people absolutely know what, where this loophole exists. And, um, you know, I, I always have a little bit of reticence about, um, enhancements, but I don't, I don't think this is an enhancement so much as a correction in, in a code that was incorrectly drafted in the past. Um, so I'm fully supportive and, um, look forward to, um, further consideration on the house floor. And I'm sure that you, you're an amazing Bill sponsor. I'm sure that you'll continue to have discussions to make sure we get it right. And I appreciate running those. Thanks.

I, I just want to clarify one thing, that under currently under code section 41 dash six a dash 4 0 1 8 2 B, that the court has discretion regarding screening, assessment, treatment, and participation in an educational series or 24 7 presentation to address one of the comments that were made that's not part of this bill that's currently in the code. So of course, I'm always happy to talk to, um, stakeholders moving forward, but this is a loophole that is long past, uh, closing and I would encourage your support. Thank you.

You. I'm gonna be speaking to the third Sub. Okay. I Dunno how each committee here does it a little bit Differently. So Yeah, we'll, we'll move it after you speak.

Okay. Uh, this bill is, uh, uh, a bill long past due currently in our code, you are incentivized to leave the scene of a crime if you have injured or killed somebody and are impaired. And so this bill simply says we are going to align the penalties for DUI, uh, with, uh, uh, a hit and run involving injury or, or death. Um, the, the number we have approximately 13 hit and runs a day in Utah, 13. Um, and the incentive to leave is very, very real. So, um, I'm just gonna give my witnesses one minute to talk about why this is important to them. Please state your name and briefly, briefly share your story.

Yes. My name's, my name's Brad Van Orman. Uh, I am a victim of a hit and run accident that killed my daughter, Lindsey Van Orman. Um, this is very difficult to sum up. Um, the hit and run case number ending in 9 4 3 0, uh, was investigated by Utah, by the UPD and working with the Investigator Officer Ock. Uh, and looking at the charges for this criminal, I asked the investigator, you know, uh, hit and run is the only charge when my daughter is dead. And he said, that's not what he feels like should happen. There should be an enhancement, uh, because of the death in the hit and run. But that's not how the law reads. And, uh, in the sentencing hearing, the Honorable Judge Gardner, uh, told Jonathan Lyman, which was the suspect. Uh, and I quote, I've sentenced you to the maximum that I can under the law. There is no more that I can do. And, uh, I, along with the Utah victims of crime and the Utah homicide survivors, uh, feel that this charge as a felony three in a hit and run case involving death is not adequate and needs to be reworked.

Uh, lastly, I'd like to, uh, give Glendon Mitchell just a, a moment to, to share their story.

My name is Glennon Mitchell. I think most of you know our family situation. My 13-year-old grandson, I represent myself. My 13-year-old grandson was killed in 2022 by hit and run driver. This particular driver, um, had multiple opportunities to stop and render aid to my grandson. We, uh, just finished a parole hearing yesterday and got to hear all about that again, which is extremely painful. But, um, he, um, fled, uh, drove about a 45 minute drive to Saratoga Springs, ditched his truck, um, arrived at his home about two hours later. Um, for several reasons, his BAC wasn't taken, uh, until midnight. So six hours after the incident, um, he was still two times over the legal limit. So in our case, the driver was impaired. Uh, he was, uh, calculated to be at nearly seven times over the limit when he killed Eli. Um, I would even, can I just tell you the pain? So it's one thing to have your heart demolished when, when an officer tells you someone has been killed like that, if you have any breath left in you, it's taken away when they tell you the driver fled. And then when you learn that they had op mul, our particular driver had multiple opportunities, you should have stopped. I flipped a u-turn on and on. It won't take your time. Um, I, I just plead with you to support this bill with no changes.

The last thing I'll say is that the third substitute moves the DUI the driver's license hearing from back to 10 days from five days. That was a compromise I worked on with the defense attorneys. And so at this juncture, I think I've pretty much resolved the main concerns that exist with the bill. So that will conclude my presentation. Mr. Chair, happy to answer any questions.

Just, uh, I generally, I um, I'm in line with you. Everything in the bill, especially in the third sub is the six hour self-reporting. Was that part of the earlier code? And forgive me if I have didn't find it myself in

The bill. Um, I don't believe it was part of earlier code, but it's basically incentive to say if you did make the decision to flee, you still have an incentive within a short window to, to self-report. And that can be considered in sentencing. It's not a get outta jail free card. You're still in big trouble, but there's still a reason for you to come back.

Okay. And that, where did the six hours come from? Is that, I, I don't know. That seems reasonable to Be, but I don't, I dunno. When I did flight training, they said eight hours bottle to throttle. So maybe it's like beyond that they can't, couldn't really sample their BAC, but, um, I It seems reasonable. I just didn't know if there was some sort of methodology there.

Not really. It seems reasonable. Alright, thank you.

You bet. Thank you. My name's Jeremy Mitchell. I live in West Jordan and I just wanna reemphasize as well. Um, my dad just spoke to you. My son is Eli Mitchell. Many of you have probably seen the picture. We've, we've tried to do a lot of advocacy to try to help make changes so that we can hopefully prevent this from happening to people in the future. I still ask myself every day, what if the gentleman that hit my son would've, uh, would've stopped? I think he knew the law. I think he knew there was a loophole. It was a six DUI. He had worked with, I think, amazing defense attorneys that had taught him that he knew that if he could get alcohol out of his system, he would have a lesser sentence. And it discourages me. 'cause I'm like, if you would've stopped, maybe the truck wouldn't have ran over my son and killed him. This is what he, I I knew he knew what he did. 'cause this is his bike with his candy that he left at the scene after he pulled it out out from under his truck. So I would just highly support, um, please support this bill. I think it will save lives. People just need to stop when they hit somebody. I would stop. Most human beings would. So thank you for the opportunity and time to speak to you today.

So there is a third sub, a reminder. Oh yeah. So, uh, motion to or move? Yeah. Motion to move. Third. Substitute to HB 4 23. Alright,

Another motion. Motion To favorably recommend third substitute HB 4 23. We motion favorably Recommend the third sub discussion.

Uh, thank you Mr. Speaker. Motion to move, move the first substitute to HB 4 23 in my name First substitute or second substitute representative. I'm Sorry. Second substitute. There we go.

Uh, yes. Thank you. This has a, a minor change requested by the courts to make sure that we pull extreme DUI into certain components of sentencing.

Thank you Mr. Speaker. Uh, this is a very important bill. On average today alone, there'll be 14 people in the state of Utah that cause an accident and flee the scene. In 2020, we had about 3,900 hit and runs, but every year since then, we have averaged over 5,000 hit and runs a year. Unfortunately, under current code drivers that cause a hit and an accident, and then the scene are incentivized to do so because the penalties, if they are impaired, are less severe for hit and run than they are for causing an accident and being convicted of driving under the influence. Uh, this bill seeks to remedy that issue and aligns the DUI, uh, penalties, uh, for hit and runs involving acce, or excuse me, involving injury and fatalities with the DUI, uh, penalties and the code. Um, it also, uh, creates, uh, enhanced, uh, penalties if an individual has been previously convicted of DUI or hit and run and then is subsequently involved in another hit and run. In terms of enhancing the, the penalties, it also provides, uh, a six hour window where if an individual will, uh, return to the scene or report themselves to law enforcement, that those penalties can be, uh, slightly reduced. There's even some allowance that if it's longer than six hours, that that can be included in for consideration during sentencing. Uh, why does this, this matter? Um, lining incentives that we want them to stop and help and render aid, which is the current law, and reporting is always the better choice. Instead of fleeing, it promotes public safety awareness, accountability, and does not reward fleeing the scene of an accident, which unfortunately our current code promotes. Uh, some of the families I've visited with during the course of, uh, this bill, their stories have been extremely sobering, uh, sobering. The, uh, accident a few years ago involving, involving Eli Mitchell individual had been convicted five prior times. He hit Eli Mitchell, dragged him under his truck on his bike, uh, then got out, pulled the bike out, and left the scene, which under current code, if he knew that, that he could get away without being convicted of DUI, the penalty would've been less. Luckily, uh, uh, bystander saw the individual and reported it, and individual was apprehends now in prison. So bottom line is this aligns penalties for fatal hit and run an automobile homicide, uh, with our DUI code and should hopefully encourage individuals that, again, this is happening far too often to remain at the scene. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I think this is a very common sense, uh, change that is many years past due and hope for your support. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Motion to move, move the first substitute to HB 4 23 in my name First substitute or second substitute representative. I'm Sorry. Second substitute. There we go.

Uh, yes. Thank you. This has a, a minor change requested by the courts to make sure that we pull extreme DUI into certain components of sentencing.

Thank you Mr. Speaker. Uh, this is a very important bill. On average today alone, there'll be 14 people in the state of Utah that cause an accident and flee the scene. In 2020, we had about 3,900 hit and runs, but every year since then, we have averaged over 5,000 hit and runs a year. Unfortunately, under current code drivers that cause a hit and an accident, and then the scene are incentivized to do so because the penalties, if they are impaired, are less severe for hit and run than they are for causing an accident and being convicted of driving under the influence. Uh, this bill seeks to remedy that issue and aligns the DUI, uh, penalties, uh, for hit and runs involving acce, or excuse me, involving injury and fatalities with the DUI, uh, penalties and the code. Um, it also, uh, creates, uh, enhanced, uh, penalties if an individual has been previously convicted of DUI or hit and run and then is subsequently involved in another hit and run. In terms of enhancing the, the penalties, it also provides, uh, a six hour window where if an individual will, uh, return to the scene or report themselves to law enforcement, that those penalties can be, uh, slightly reduced. There's even some allowance that if it's longer than six hours, that that can be included in for consideration during sentencing.

Uh, why does this, this matter? Um, lining incentives that we want them to stop and help and render aid, which is the current law, and reporting is always the better choice. Instead of fleeing, it promotes public safety awareness, accountability, and does not reward fleeing the scene of an accident, which unfortunately our current code promotes. Uh, some of the families I've visited with during the course of, uh, this bill, their stories have been extremely sobering, uh, sobering. The, uh, accident a few years ago involving, involving Eli Mitchell individual had been convicted five prior times. He hit Eli Mitchell, dragged him under his truck on his bike, uh, then got out, pulled the bike out, and left the scene, which under current code, if he knew that, that he could get away without being convicted of DUI, the penalty would've been less. Luckily, uh, uh, bystander saw the individual and reported it, and individual was apprehends now in prison. So bottom line is this aligns penalties for fatal hit and run an automobile homicide, uh, with our DUI code and should hopefully encourage individuals that, again, this is happening far too often to remain at the scene. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I think this is a very common sense, uh, change that is many years past due and hope for your support. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

for fatal hit and runs with automobile homicide, which eliminates the incentive. Get this for impaired drivers to flee, uh, the scene of an accident in hopes of facing a lesser charge. It enhances penalties for repeat offenders while creating a six hour self-reporting incentive that encourages drivers to come forward and accept responsibilities. Uh, believe it or not, the current law in Utah, um, will sometimes allow someone that flees a scene of a hit and run when they're drinking, uh, to, to get a lesser penalty than if they would've remained at the scene. And this bill addresses that gap in the law. So with that, I'll yield to any questions.

Thank you. I'd move that house. Bill 4 23 pass. Thank You. And the question is, under

before we need to circle, um, I need to move to adopt the, um, the fifth sub, um, which was the same as the fourth sub, but it wasn't in, um, a senator's name. And real quickly, uh, so I'd like to move to adopt the fifth sub and I'll explain that Again.

Yeah. Let me explain the fifth sub first. Well, Yeah, so this is the bill that increases, well it eliminates the, um, the, the incentive for a drunk driver to leave the scene of the accident. Um, because right now with the current law, if they leave the scene of the accident, they can actually be rewarded for that by being charged with a lesser crime. And so this is trying to actually incentivize them to either stay or to turn themselves in, uh, relatively quickly. So the fifth sub, uh, just primarily makes some technical changes, um, waiting for the computer load. Yeah, so the fifth sub, uh, merely makes technical changes. There's nothing substantive in that. Uh, I think it was req. It, it does. Um, in line one 60 it says conviction means the same as the term is defined in 77 dash 38 B dash 1 0 2. So with that I'd move that we adopt the fifth sub

Yeah. And then very quickly, Senator, um, sorry. Representative Eliason, uh, is calling this Lindsay's bill because Lindsey Van Orman was killed on July 27th, 2024 by a drunk driver. That was shortly after she had graduated from Olympus High School. Uh, she was full of life, enjoyed swimming, skiing, rafting, and being outdoors, enjoyed people. She had a gift for connecting anyone she met. She was killed by a drunk driver who had, uh, a wrap sheet as long as my arm. Uh, he had 11 previous driving citations, six outstanding warrants and no driving privileges when he was two feet outside of the fog line, traveling above the speed limit when he hit and killed Lindsey. So, um, Senator, sorry. Representative Elison, um, is referring to this as Lindsey's bill and under this bill due the severity of Jonathan's actions that that's the driver who killed her and the background, the felony three counts could be changed to felony two that would support the victims left behind in the wake of criminals like Mr. Lyman who took her life, uh, because of his negligence and recklessness. So with that, I would yield to any questions on fifth substitute house Bill 4 23.

Thank you. I move that fifth substitute house Bill 4 23 pass.

Senator Vickers Baldry Lein Bramer. Bus. Bus Comore Escamia Fillmore Grover Harper Hankins Ipson Johnson Quan McKay, Mikel Milner Musselman Owens pitcher Plum Rebi Sandal Stevenson Stratton Bickers Weiler Aye. Wilson Aye. Winterton President Adams Aye.

Thank you Mr. Speaker Pro Tem Motion to concur with the Senate amendments motion

Uh, yes. Thank you. Uh, we put an amendment in relating to the driver's license reinstatement fee for, uh, DUI offenses, which, uh, uh, eliminated the, the fiscal note. And, uh, that's basically, uh, what it does. In the meantime, we've named this bill after Lindsey and F Orman who was killed by a, a drunk driver and was really the inspiration behind this bill. So thank you Mr. Speaker Pro tem.